VectorLinux

The Vectorian Lounge => The Lounge => Topic started by: helios on April 11, 2007, 06:04:41 am

Title: Attention Vector Community...you might find this interesting
Post by: helios on April 11, 2007, 06:04:41 am
As you know, I am a fan and supporter of Vector.  My absence lately can be easily understood once you read the press release below.  This is more exciting than anything we've done in a long time and the level of support "behind the scenes" is impressive.  This is the "official" press release, but I felt compelled to personalize it to you and a coupld of other groups.  This could be a big thing not only for Linuxbut VectorLinux as well. - helios

Tux is entering the Indianapolis 500  http://www.tux500.com


That is the hope and that hope can become reality...but then again, that's up to you.

"Linux" as a viable desktop alternative to Microsoft Windows IS ready for the Desktop, both for The Enterprise and the Home User.   The point is we need some advertising exposure.  LINUX in general needs advertising exposure.  The Boxset Corporations have, to a degree, started to advertise but Linux as represented by the rest of us has not.  To kick off the Official "LIFE project", (Linux is for Everyone), and several different advertising campaigns, The Community is banding together to sponsor a car in the Indy 500.  Go to Tux500.com for details and see what is in store for the community through this effort.    The Boxset Corporations will be given a chance to participate as well, so their donations are an important part of this effort.

Here is the official announcement here http://blog.lobby4linux.com/archives/116-Linux-Users-Start.....Your.....ENGINES!.html or here
http://tux500.com/geeklog/

This is a magnificent opportunity for each Linux Distro as well as the Linux community at large.  It is time to get our motors started and pop the clutch on this baby.  Let's open 'er up and see what she can do.  The finish line is quickly approaching and we don't want to be left at the starting line.

Tux500.com
Title: Re: Attention Vector Community...you might find this interesting
Post by: blurymind on April 11, 2007, 08:06:43 am
interesting...
I've never been a fan of f1. Usually when watching it for more or less than an hour,i get bored to tears... I dont have a buck or a paypal ( there is no paypal for my country )..so, sry,i cant help.  ::)
Title: Re: Attention Vector Community...you might find this interesting
Post by: The Headacher on April 11, 2007, 10:04:03 am
I don't think sponsoring a race is going to make a huge difference. There are lots of better places to advertise than on a car that drives >300 Km/h on an oval IMO.

Please don't get me wrong, but (if I wasn't a sort of broke student) I'd rather sponsor some of the fine software projects that I use regularly (vl, slack, openoffice) than I'd sponsor an expensive car driving in circles. It's like burning perfectly good money to barbecue or something.. sure, you'll get a fire, but it's helluva expensive.
Title: Re: Attention Vector Community...you might find this interesting
Post by: helios on April 11, 2007, 02:23:51 pm
OK...I will see to it that your responses represent the Vector Community in this effort,

thanks

helios
Title: Re: Attention Vector Community...you might find this interesting
Post by: Masta on April 11, 2007, 07:08:15 pm
Well, let's just step back a minute here, ok? It seems to me that the larger picture is being missed here. Sure the money seems pretty steep, say for just a  few people, but when you gather up a lot of people, to just toss in say 2 dollars, it can add up really quick. Last I looked, there is 1321 members to this forum alone. Imagine how much can be raised if just each of them tossed out a single dollar.
 Now the thought that the money is being spent on a super fast car going around a track, might be a bit distracting from the actual benefits that's at hand here.

In the U.S. the Indy500 is pretty huge, and is covered quite broadly via television and radio. Whether the driver of the sponsored car wins the race or not, you're looking at some very huge advertisement for this distro. If we ended up being the top sponsors , the VL logo and name get plastered in the most viewed spots of the car. And doesn't it make sense to have the "fastest" distro on a fast car?

The advertisement idea behind this, could bring a huge promotion for VL. And normally , huge promotions come back as donations, and possibly corporate backing, which can definitely benefit VL for it's future, which in turn benefits it's users.

I feel a little bit disappointed in the above replies (no pun or insult to anyone), they seem rather negative, and I can't understand why people would claim themselves as a "die hard" fan of this distro, and yet not take an opportunity to encourage it's promotions. Even if one couldn't afford ,by himself, to make a donation towards the project of tux500, couldn't you at least encourage those who can?

Personally, I'm tired of the big Debian based distros taking up the spotlight of Linux, and in some cases making it look bad. We have just as much to offer in VL, as any of the big distros do, and VL hasn't really ever let me down, has it you?  Let's try to help get VL in the spotlight that it truly deserves to be in.

I'm not a wealthy person myself, but I will certainly try to make sure that any spare dough I can cough up, will go towards a chance (at least) to help my favorite distro propel.
Title: Re: Attention Vector Community...you might find this interesting
Post by: retired1af on April 11, 2007, 07:17:07 pm
Hear hear!! (Just wish it was NASCAR instead of F1..  ;D )
Title: Re: Attention Vector Community...you might find this interesting
Post by: LLL on April 11, 2007, 09:00:17 pm
A nifty idea...I despise auto-racing, but for the goals of the project, it's a well-chosen medium.

$923 donated after one day (last I checked).

Good luck! :)
Title: Re: Attention Vector Community...you might find this interesting
Post by: The Headacher on April 12, 2007, 12:39:20 am
Quote
And doesn't it make sense to have the "fastest" distro on a fast car?

Masta, you don't honestly believe the VL community could raise enough money to put vl on a car do you? AFAIU, the advertisement is for Linux in general, not just our little distro (which is a good thing, our forum host would get pretty mad if 1000 people would visit it at the same time).

Every now and then people come up with some scheme that will make Linux in general better known or VL in particular a little more used. But do you really look at advertisements on a car during a race? I know I don't. I've been watching the entire last season of F1 and I can't say I recall much of the advertisers on the cars. I recall Marlboro being sponsor for the Ferrari team. I've never bought a pack of Marlboro's though, despite having smoked for quite a while (I quit some months ago).

There are soo many advertisements all around us. I can't say for sure I never bought something that has been advertised for. I can say I try to avoid it. If you make a decent product you don't need to advertise. People will find you. I found VL on some site dedicated to linux. Not because of some billboard.

Quote
(Just wish it was NASCAR instead of F1..  ;D )
It's not formula 1 either... they usually have both left AND right corners ;).
Title: Re: Attention Vector Community...you might find this interesting
Post by: hata_ph on April 12, 2007, 01:29:51 am
Using that bunch of money for more useful things like R&D is better then the ad in a car racing.
Just my personal though!!!  8)
Title: Re: Attention Vector Community...you might find this interesting
Post by: Masta on April 12, 2007, 03:33:35 pm
Hear hear!! (Just wish it was NASCAR instead of F1..  ;D )

NASCAR would have been my choice too  ;D
but a start somewhere.

Quote
Masta, you don't honestly believe the VL community could raise enough money to put vl on a car do you?
Yes, I do believe.  I may be a bit optimistic, but I have a good outlook to our community.

Quote
I found VL on some site dedicated to linux. Not because of some billboard
Pretty much makes my point. Not many find VL, unless they know it exists. Most that do end up finding it, pretty much have been around Linux for quite some time, yet never even heard of VL. Just so happens that they end up "discovering" it by accident. This can change that.
Quote
...our forum host would get pretty mad if 1000 people would visit it at the same time...
I personally know of a host that wouldn't mind it at all, and would (also personally) pay for that host if there's a problem with the amount of traffic from our current hosting.

Yes, there are many advertisement programs promoting Linux, but not one them actually helping out VL. In fact they're designed to help the larger, more corporately designed distros such as Suse and Red Hat and even Ubuntu, etc.. they pay a lot for those designed advertising leading towards their benefits, no reason we couldn't do it for our distro and benefit it.
Title: Re: Attention Vector Community...you might find this interesting
Post by: LLL on April 12, 2007, 04:52:02 pm
...do you really look at advertisements on a car during a race? I know I don't.

Eyeball,

You raise some good points, but I think you missed one here. I believe the project's hope is that a  community-sponsored car (as opposed to the rest sponsored by a single individual or corporate entity) would garner media attention because of that novelty and derive benefits beyond the simple printing of ads on the car.

Whether that makes it a good idea or a bad one, I don't know - but hey: It's just as easy to look at someone's dream and say "Yes...and how?" and help them jump hurdles as it is to throw up the roadblocks.

I agree that VL's individual benefit is not the goal.

To each their own...good luck to us! :)

LLL
Title: Re: Attention Vector Community...you might find this interesting
Post by: Monty67 on April 12, 2007, 06:04:35 pm
Great post.

From someone who is a huge F1 fan (and might be associated with a podcast that happens to cover said sport ;-)) and a VL fan as well this is a great idea in theory. I'd like to address a few points.

1. It's not an F1 race it's an IRL /Indy race. If you look at the tires you'll see that it has Firehawks. F1 currently has all teams running Bridgestone.

2. Nascar vs F1 vs Indy. From a marketing point of view you need to define your target audience. If you are looking to cover the US then NASCAR is the way to go since F1 is known by few and liked by less in the states. Indy league on the other hand is the American "version" of F1 and does not share NASCARs following except for the Indy 500. On the other hand if you are looking to hit the international audience F1 wins this race with ease. F1 is the number auto racing series on the planet (WRC being #2). Millions of people watching in hundreds of different countries would definitely give you the most bang for your advertising buck.

Overall given the Indy leagues status in the US you might be able to pull something off but at what cost?

3. Compaq - HP used to sponsor the F1 Williams BMW team and everything I read about this sponsorship was positive for the PC maker. One only need look at Lenovo jumping into the mix to understand how valuable having your name on an F1 car is.

With the above in mind the Lenovo contract was worth 30Million to get their name all over that car. To get the word VectorlLinux on any part of that car would probably be in the millions unless it was a one shot deal or some special contest winner.  I agree it's a great idea to get the Linux word out there but trying to do it via a sponsorship is not going to happen. See above, stick with the Indy league and to just one race albeit one of the world's most popular races.

4. Use the money more wisely.

Good linux centric commercials during the race. Problem - Expensive.
or
Put the money into development so that Linux FUD gets killed once and for all. 

Great idea in theory and great post. Thanks for bringing it up.
Title: Re: Attention Vector Community...you might find this interesting
Post by: helios on April 13, 2007, 04:41:33 am
Good linux centric commercials during the race. Problem - Expensive.
or
Put the money into development so that Linux FUD gets killed once and for all.

Great idea in theory and great post. Thanks for bringing it up.

THIS is where you are wrong.  This is where tens of thousands of Linux Users just like you are wrong, dead-in-the-water wrong.

And Linux will remain dead-in-the-water until this thinking changes.

I have personalliy poured thousands of my own dollars out of my own bank account, earned from my own employment into the development of Linux/FOSS applications.  And it even helped some.  But if you think that this is going to do anything but stir up local recognition and appreciation, you remain dead-in-the-water wrong.  The ONLY way you are going to kill FUD is by making the consumer aware of what it is, what you have to offer and why it is better than what it is using.  I am personally responsible for three hundred one on one conversions to Linux.  Do you know what the number one question I am asked...I mean by a three to one margin?

Why haven't I heard of this before.

We need to support our development structure.  There is no logical argument to the contrary.  But to think that this is going to somehow magically spread the word of Linux to those who don't know about it is almost naive.  It hasn't worked to this point and it is not going to either.  We have attempted at least four other projects to mass market Linux.  It's odd, there are many of you who offer the same arguments regardless of the project.  If this is you, you might want to read the following article.  http://www.lobby4linux.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=39&Itemid=1

LLL nailed it concisely:  You raise some good points, but I think you missed one here. I believe the project's hope is that a  community-sponsored car (as opposed to the rest sponsored by a single individual or corporate entity) would garner media attention because of that novelty and derive benefits beyond the simple printing of ads on the car.


What you suggest does nothing to propagate Linux.  All it really does is result in a lot of internal back-slapping and in-shop ladder-climbing.  Meanwhile Redmond continues with their 9 man meetings, deciding just how to destroy GNU/Linux.

helios
Title: Re: Attention Vector Community...you might find this interesting
Post by: saulgoode on April 13, 2007, 07:38:46 am
My main concern with Linux is increasing the amount of development and I really could care less whether someone else uses it (beyond the extent that it helps further development). That being said, I think this is a worthwhile venture and will be making a donation.

While donating to development directly is certainly a good idea, this approach has the potential of raising awareness of the benefits of Free Software development in the corporate offices of computing-based companies. While I don't presume that Joe Sixpack (Steve Martini might be more appropriate for Indy) will change OSes because of a logo on the side of a racing car, it is conceivable that a boardroom full of executives might be just a little more attentive -- having an awareness of the term "Linux" -- when a programmer proposes that his project might benefit from being released under an open source license.

Though I am not by any means an Indy racefan (or F1, or NASCAR, etc), and I am adamantly opposed to subverting the ideals of Free Software in an effort to gain market share (ala ESR&Landley), I think this scheme is a worthwhile approach worthy of support. There is little to be lost, potential for a decent gain, and the basic "coolness" of having a penguin on an Indy 500 car.
Title: Re: Attention Vector Community...you might find this interesting
Post by: rbistolfi on April 13, 2007, 09:13:30 am
Everybody here have a little reason. Personally i think Linux is so much more than an OS. The Linux development system is the essential thing, and that is the diff with ms and the others. If XP or whatever  is better than Linux or viceversa, is an important topic but come in second place.
We need to  tell to the world about Linux. This had been written in this forum some times. The thing we don't accord yet is how. I think we accord in this: we must not look like some religion fan or something like that. But nothing positive yet, we accord in things we must not to do, but nothing else. This need to be discussed by the community.
The proprietary software has his strategy. Their spend a lot of money in publicity. Their have some pacts with hardware manufacturers, with the sellers, etc, etc, we all know that.
We really want to do that? We want to take that way to win the "desktop war" or something?
This is not a rhetoric question. I am seriously asking this. I have not the answer.
May be the answer is yes, may be not.
Linux already won some battles, i.e. the server market. When hi performance is involved, Linux is there and not ms. This is a good point to work with in our goal to increase the Linux users. May be working for Linux being used by the Indy/F1 engineers and get a "Linux powered car" is a good idea, of course, people must know about that, and advertisement is involved here.
So, i think this needs more discussion, and all the post here have some good points.

@helios: good luck, i hope you are rigth and not me, and please not get offended if i disagree about the use of a sponsored car. If you get your goal I will be supporting your car, and i hope this will be good to the Linux community.

PS: Excuse my english, I have not time to check this post, I usually do that (with poor results  :().

Title: Re: Attention Vector Community...you might find this interesting
Post by: Monty67 on April 13, 2007, 06:44:06 pm
@Helios

IMHO until Linux can be installed in any system without issue, all the marketing in the world won't help. Right now people are struggling to get across the board Wifi and Ati cards working. Keep in mind that most people don't even know which version of Win they are running. These people won't be able to obtain the correct "binaries" never mind install it. 

Like I said IMHO, 100% hardware support and preinstalls are key. Once there we can add the marketing.

Thanks for the great discussion.
Title: Re: Attention Vector Community...you might find this interesting
Post by: Joe1962 on April 13, 2007, 07:39:45 pm
Right now people are struggling to get across the board Wifi and Ati cards working.
I think Nvidia is the one giving most trouble lately, judging from the forum. Recent Ati drivers seem to just work, at least for me.
Title: Re: Attention Vector Community...you might find this interesting
Post by: rbistolfi on April 13, 2007, 07:58:06 pm
Quote
Right now people are struggling to get across the board Wifi and Ati cards working. Keep in mind that most people don't even know which version of Win they are running. These people won't be able to obtain the correct "binaries" never mind install it. 

Like I said IMHO, 100% hardware support and preinstalls are key. Once there we can add the marketing.

Yes, but we are in a circle now. Without more users, hardware manufacturers will not releases drivers and linux support; and without drivers and support the linux users will not increase ???.

Looks like we need to find another way.

If you ask me, at least in my country, only having some nice girls in the internet with access restricted to linux users will do the work. But once again we are in a circle: Why we will want to that kind of guy using linux? ;D

PS: If you make that website a will go to look (if my girl is sleeping, of course) ;D ;D
Title: Re: Attention Vector Community...you might find this interesting
Post by: Monty67 on April 17, 2007, 01:44:08 pm
While reading this:

http://www.howtoforge.com/network_monitoring_with_ntop (http://www.howtoforge.com/network_monitoring_with_ntop)

I found this in the NEWS category to the right of the article:

http://penguinpetes.com/b2evo/index.php?title=tux500_news_history&more=1&c=1&tb=1&pb=1 (http://penguinpetes.com/b2evo/index.php?title=tux500_news_history&more=1&c=1&tb=1&pb=1)

Draw your own conclusions.

Title: Re: Attention Vector Community...you might find this interesting
Post by: Masta on April 18, 2007, 04:31:19 am
Very interesting.

Devnet responds:
http://linux-blog.org/index.php?/archives/2007/04.html (http://linux-blog.org/index.php?/archives/2007/04.html)

devnet normally doesn't respond to such things like this, so this has my concerns raised. And of course from my experiences with the last distro,(devnet seems to be highly related to), bashing seems to be a thing of commons there.

Guess we'll have to watch the show  ::)

Edited by JohnB316 to change the link to devnet's posting.
Title: Re: Attention Vector Community...you might find this interesting
Post by: Toe on May 24, 2007, 03:33:24 pm
Caught the pics up on C|Net:

http://news.com.com/2300-11389_3-6186004.html?tag=st.gall
Title: Re: Attention Vector Community...you might find this interesting
Post by: metvas on May 24, 2007, 08:37:40 pm
Hello All:
Vector Linux did make a modest donation to this effort. It is important to support objectives although not our own, but for the greater cause.
regards
Darrell
Title: Re: Attention Vector Community...you might find this interesting
Post by: Masta on May 29, 2007, 09:27:16 pm
Well, I don't think the race went as we might have hoped  ;D , but it was worth the pennies. I'd like to take just a minute to congratulate Helios. Yes that's right, Helios raised 20K (I can't recall the exact amount right off, but estimation won't hurt nothing). Even though FUD was dropped in, controversy started, and fists were seemingly about to fly... Helios stuck to his honesty, and raised what he could through all of that. Helios has always been a good friend to me over several years, and when I saw his post about raising money for a tux500, I knew for sure that the money raised was going to get there.

So, now in the end, I am pleased that the actual proof is now available for everyone to see. Helios, needs to pat himself on the back, not just for yet another great donation raising effort into what he believes in, but for sticking it out as , for the first time ever, FUD and controversy were implanted.

I know without that crap getting in the way, there most likely would have been a lot more donations, but there wasn't, and yet what donations that did come in, was quite impressive. So to all those that were opposed to it,, I'd say now is the time to draw your tails back between your legs, and sit back down until you're asked to get up  ;)  In the future it will be quite difficult to attempt to sabotage fund raising lead by our good friend Helios, based on the proof at hand.
 
Title: Re: Attention Vector Community...you might find this interesting
Post by: metvas on May 29, 2007, 10:01:33 pm
The VL community rallied in the effort. For that we are ALL doners to the project. Everyone donated when VL donated. I hope his dreams continue to become reality, and wish them as it is more than one person supporting this effort the best.
Regards
Darrell