VectorLinux

The Vectorian Lounge => The Lounge => Topic started by: ekp on July 13, 2007, 07:20:09 am

Title: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: ekp on July 13, 2007, 07:20:09 am
My daughter is leaving for college this fall and as every parent does I bought her a laptop for college.  It was an IBM thinkpad with all the bells and whistles including dual core and 2g of RAM.  Vista came installed.  Well after having played around on it for a while I have come to the conclusion that it is the most bloated piece of crap I have seen in a long time.  I hate looking at an LCD and all the power sucking programs running in the background make it slower than my XP1800 with only 250 mgs of RAM.  Of course if you are running MS then you have to have antispam, antiphish, antivirus and firewall all running all the time for fear of getting caught with your pants down on the internet.

The desktop is so busy as to make your eyes hurt.  IE 7.0 reminds me of the stupid browser that AOL put together for their dummies.

I will keep my desktop,CRT and Linux .........."thank you very much"

Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: tomh38 on July 13, 2007, 11:57:49 am
ekp,

I agree with except for the part about LCD monitors.  Having said that, I hate laptops.  The keyboards tend to be small and even less ergonomic than regular computer keyboards, those little touchpad things are a real PITA, upgrading is very difficult, and if any part of the thing goes bad the chances are that you have to send the thing back to the manufacturer to have it repaired, since the electronics are all munged together with the chassis.

And yes, Windows Vista sucks donkey ... uh ... kong.
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: lagagnon on July 13, 2007, 02:47:22 pm
Spot on about the laptop comments ... it is a fact also that laptops are twice as prone to failure as desktops and twice as expensive to repair. Of course, they are also very eaily stolen. I never recommend them to my clients unless they absolutely must have them for their work. CRT screens still have much faster response time than any LCD and thus fast action gaming is still much easier on the eyes on a CRT.
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: The Headacher on July 14, 2007, 05:52:40 am
I agree that touchpads aren't too great, but if you forgot your mouse they're better than nothing (I prefer using an optical USB mouse though). How well would a desktop work without a mouse? It would be hell for most of us. On a laptop, you can still use the touchpad. It isn't meant to replace the mouse in office situations, it's there for when you're out and need to use the laptop. If you actually have to use the laptop on your lap, where will you use the mouse? On the legs of the person sitting next to you?

If you do work at an office and do use a laptop as your main computer, you can always decide to dock it. Just attach a keyboard, a mouse and a monitor, and you'll be able to use it more ergonomically.

I use my laptop "everywhere"; I take it to school, I take it with me to a friend if we're going to make some music, I take it with me if I'm going to visit my mother (she's a real computer junky too). Try that with a desktop and a crt monitor.

I don't mean to say that laptops are superior to desktops or the other way around, just that they're meant to be used differently. If you buy a laptop and just use it as a desktop it's a waste of money. But if you want to have your own computer with you wherever you go it's the way to go.
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: tomh38 on July 14, 2007, 08:30:52 am
Oh, I agree with you completely, The Headacher.  For mobility laptops are a must-have, and work very well in that regard.  Personally, I don't need that mobility in my work or for fun.  I'm sure if I did, I would get used to what I find are the inconveniences of laptops.  Perhaps some day I will need to.

Also, sorry to repeat myself, but ... Vista sucks.
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: GrannyGeek on July 14, 2007, 11:24:04 am
I think you laptop bashers are nuts!<g>

I have two desktops and one laptop. I've had a laptop since 1993. I don't travel. I seldom take my laptop anywhere. So why would I never, ever be without a laptop?

Because it unchains me from the desktop! I spend just about every evening sitting on a comfy rocking chair in the living room with my feet up while I watch TV and do my e-mail, forums, and Web browsing. I have enough Ethernet connections around the house so that I can sit anywhere, or even out on the deck, and be connected to the Net.

Yes, laptops cost more, comparatively, than desktops, but not so much these days. You can get a perfectly adequate laptop anytime for $450 US or less. Yes, if something goes wrong, you probably need a pro to fix it. You just have to keep your fingers crossed that you don't have a problem, and there's a good chance that you won't.

I don't like touchpads. Instead, I use a regular USB mouse. I use the laptop on a small lap desk and there is enough room for the mouse. If you're traveling light, there actually is enough space on the part between the keyboard and the front of the laptop to run a wireless notebook mouse if you have to use the laptop on your lap. Or use the touchpad in those circumstances. If you turn off "tap to click" the touchpad isn't so bad.

As for LCDs, I much prefer them to CRTs because they seem to be brighter, so easier for my aging eyes to see. I can't stand the way CRTs take up SO MUCH space and they also give off a lot of heat. Right now my two desktops have LCDs and the laptop does, too, of course. lagagnon: "CRT screens still have much faster response time than any LCD and thus fast action gaming is still much easier on the eyes on a CRT." LCDs have become much faster and I don't think CRTs are *much* easier on the eyes now. That used to be true.

The fact that I cared enough to bother to write this should tell you something because I've been afflicted with what is probably gout in the lower knuckle of my left little finger. Very painful. To reduce pain caused by movement we immobilized my little finger. After 50 years of touch typing, having no use of my left little finger is difficult and I'm making lots of typing mistakes. Fortunately, the finger is much better today and I should be able to remove the splint in a couple of days.
--GrannyGeek
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: GrannyGeek on July 14, 2007, 11:24:45 am
My daughter is leaving for college this fall and as every parent does I bought her a laptop for college.  It was an IBM thinkpad with all the bells and whistles including dual core and 2g of RAM.  Vista came installed.  Well after having played around on it for a while I have come to the conclusion that it is the most bloated piece of crap I have seen in a long time.  I hate looking at an LCD and all the power sucking programs running in the background make it slower than my XP1800 with only 250 mgs of RAM.  Of course if you are running MS then you have to have antispam, antiphish, antivirus and firewall all running all the time for fear of getting caught with your pants down on the internet.

The desktop is so busy as to make your eyes hurt.  IE 7.0 reminds me of the stupid browser that AOL put together for their dummies.

I will keep my desktop,CRT and Linux .........."thank you very much"


Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: GrannyGeek on July 14, 2007, 11:51:50 am
Of course if you are running MS then you have to have antispam, antiphish, antivirus and firewall all running all the time for fear of getting caught with your pants down on the internet.

It's a myth that a non-clueless user needs all that stuff running all the time. In Windows XP I use a nonsystem-sucking AV all the time. That's it. I've never used a software firewall and am firewalled through my router. For antiphishing I rely on my own brain, which has not let me down so far. I run anti-spyware software once in a while and in several years, nothing serious has ever been found, so I'm not particularly worried. My computing habits are such that I'm not likely to get infected. I don't do P2P, don't download and run programs of questionable origin, don't visit porn or similar sites, and don't click on stuff that just shows up. I've never had any malware in 20 years of computer use, 16 of them with Windows.

Quote
The desktop is so busy as to make your eyes hurt.  IE 7.0 reminds me of the stupid browser that AOL put together for their dummies.

You can use a Classic desktop and most elements are user selectable. I don't use IE7 much (Opera is my browser of choice in Windows and Linux), but I prefer IE7 to IE6 because it has tabbed browsing.

I don't use Vista but I've seen it and read a lot about it. I have no plans to get it for my present computers, only one of which is fully capable of running everything in Vista. When I get a new computer it'll come with Vista, but I don't see a new computer in the stars unless my laptop up and dies (it's 4-1/2 years old). But I use VectorLinux most of the time anyway.
--GrannyGeek
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: easuter on July 14, 2007, 12:42:58 pm
Quote from: GrannyGeek
It's a myth that a non-clueless user needs all that stuff running all the time. In Windows XP I use a nonsystem-sucking AV all the time. That's it. I've never used a software firewall and am firewalled through my router. For antiphishing I rely on my own brain, which has not let me down so far. I run anti-spyware software once in a while and in several years, nothing serious has ever been found, so I'm not particularly worried. My computing habits are such that I'm not likely to get infected. I don't do P2P, don't download and run programs of questionable origin, don't visit porn or similar sites, and don't click on stuff that just shows up. I've never had any malware in 20 years of computer use, 16 of them with Windows.

Well, thats you!  ;) :P

Some of my friends fall into the "clueless boob" category, they click on every warez and pr0n link, download non-stop using peer-to-peer. None of them have routers by the way, and so they need to run all the freeware/shareware security apps to get some kind of security. I've suggested that prudence and changing habits will prevent most of the problems, but that doesn't sink in.  ::)
Somehow some people think that having all that software installed means they are immune, kind of like thinking that because cars have airbags it means one can drive recklessly...

And thats unfortunately how a lot of people use their computers!

BTW, I also refuse to fix any computers (for free) if I've made these suggestions and have been ignored.  :P
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: tomh38 on July 14, 2007, 12:48:06 pm
GrannyGeek,

I don't hate laptops in the same way that I hate, oh, let's say ... child abuse.  I hate them in the same way I hate bananas.  I really hate bananas.  I have no problem with other people eating bananas; I just don't like the texture or the taste.  Probably "hate" is too strong a word.  It's more that I dislike laptops for myself.  Probably for me the real problem is the keyboard, which is why if I had one I'd probably use a docking station whenever possible.  Something I do dislike is when some columnist says I should ditch my desktop and get a laptop.  I see these columns from time to time.  I just don't want a laptop and won't get one until I have to (for work, for example).

Vista, on the other hand ... I've tested it and used it on other people's machines.  How Microsoft took five years to come out with this clunker is beyond me.  Since SP2 came out, Windows XP has been a really good OS, some would say excellent.  I'm recommending VL to everyone I know, but if they insist on using Windows I recommend to them that they get a copy of XP before they're all gone.

You're right that non-clueless users don't need all that stuff running all the time.  On the other hand, a lot of users don't have that clue when it comes to computers.  My sister-in-law was ready to throw out (as in the garbage) the computer I had built for her and my brother not a year earlier because it would freeze up within minutes of every boot.  Of course the thing was just loaded down with spyware and viruses, which I fixed for them in about an hour.
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: gacl on July 14, 2007, 01:34:32 pm
I only have two computers: two portables. They haven't left my desktop since i bought them. What i really like about them is that they are quieter than a desktop because the discs are smaller and they have fewer fans ( my Dell has no fans at all ).

CRTs make a high-pitched noise that i find very annoying, similar to a TV. LCDs make no noise at all, unless you count the power supply, but that one's on the floor on the carpet.

I've grown so accustomed to the touchpad that everytime i have to use a mouse it feels a little bit weird. And i hate it when i try a distro and the tapping is disabled, like in the latest version of Puppy.
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: rbistolfi on July 14, 2007, 02:34:45 pm
I am using a crt monitor. I hate this one in particular, but is a little old, small and curve. I need a new one  ::). I like crts in general, they are too big though. A flat screen is a must for your eyes health.
About laptops, I wish to have the money to buy one, they are so expensive here! And my new baby is pulling me out some resources  ;), her mother helps on that :D, what can I say, I love them both.
I work on a windows 2000 box, and I have XPSP2 too in the office. I am working on a migration to vl, I think I will convince mi chief soon  ;). I have managed to keep the xpp box to work well, but the 2000 box is a hell. Someone installed kerio personal firewall on it, good software, but not light. I did try to replace it with jetico, much lighter, but I cant turn off the kerio with out a system crash, the router is not helping at all, and a reinstall looks like a fate. The problem is hard to diagnose, the tools avaible are not working. I think you can keep your own ms box working well, but a production box, or a public one, is a little hard.
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: Kocil on July 14, 2007, 03:28:23 pm
Well, I work with laptop for about 90% of my computer time.
Since 1993, I've bought and broken/trashed 6 laptops. That's about 1 for every 3 years  ::)
But I still love them :)

but I don't love Vista ............. yet.
Maybe 5 years later, after laptops with 10 GB RAM are common.
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: Kocil on July 14, 2007, 03:42:17 pm
My daughter is leaving for college this fall and as every parent does I bought her a laptop for college.  It was an IBM thinkpad with all the bells and whistles including dual core and 2g of RAM. 

Lucky daughter ...
Who says girls don't play computers ?
And with the super laptop like this ... imagine what she can do ....
She may run VL, get vmplayer, then run 6 other VL virtual machines.
Or she can run Vista as a virtual machine too ...  :P


Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: GrannyGeek on July 14, 2007, 03:45:55 pm
I only have two computers: two portables. They haven't left my desktop since i bought them. What i really like about them is that they are quieter than a desktop because the discs are smaller and they have fewer fans ( my Dell has no fans at all ).

I forgot to mention the lower noise of a laptop. I really hate loud computers. My quietest computer isn't the laptop, though, but my Compaq desktop. You can barely hear it. It is gloriously quiet.

I've considered replacing the onboard video with a PCI-e video card but doubt the performance improvement I'd get would be worth the tradeoff in noise. I'd need a new power supply and would have to pay for one with an extremely quiet fan. The video card itself would come with a fan--more noise. I could look for one with passive cooling, but good passive cooling is expensive and I don't know if I trust the cheap passive cooling.
--GrannyGeek
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: tomh38 on July 14, 2007, 04:10:47 pm
My desktop is very quiet also.  I put in sound absorbing foam on the insides of the side panels.
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: rbistolfi on July 14, 2007, 05:22:49 pm
Well, that is nice. I hate the sound of my computer. All is loud, fans, hard drives, cd drives. I would like to have passive coolers too! But they are extremely expensive here too. But is worst, I like to play with music and I record offen. I have a nice condenser mic, but I need a very long cable to avoid the computer noise  :(.
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: gacl on July 14, 2007, 07:18:08 pm
For a number of years my only computer was a Pentium 2: No case. Motherboard and components sitting on the floor on top of a piece of cardboard. Every single fan clipped off. . . HDD in an enclosure. . . Never gave me any trouble. . . or noise. How i miss it! *sniff, sniff*

I buy my computers used. They're much cheaper, and to this date i haven't had any problems with them. And, of course, old hardware has been around for a while, which makes support, compatibility, etc, easier.
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: GrannyGeek on July 14, 2007, 08:27:20 pm
No case. Motherboard and components sitting on the floor on top of a piece of cardboard. Every single fan clipped off. . . HDD in an enclosure. . .

My cats would love that. "Look, Mom, a new playground!"
--GrannyGeek
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: nubcnubdo on July 14, 2007, 10:43:09 pm
A problem I have with most laptops is the use of black or dark-colored keyboards. I like to rely on ambient light in my house, and this light isnt sufficient to illuminate letters on a black keyboard, since black reflects very little light. In contrast, a beige, silver, or light-colored keyboard reflects sufficient light from the room to provides its own illumination, and doesnt require direct lighting.

Consequently, I must have near perfect lighting to see the letters on the black keyboard of a typical laptop, the best illumination being direct lighting which is undesired. USB lights are a response to this illumination problem on a black keyboard. OTOH, I can read letters on a beige keyboard in a dimly lit room because the lighter color reflects more light and provides better illumination and contrast for the black letters.
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: rbistolfi on July 15, 2007, 11:09:42 am
The users of this forum are hard to content, which is good.
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: Jerry on July 16, 2007, 08:20:04 am
(from the first post) "..I hate looking at an LCD and all the power sucking programs running in the background.."

I'm sure it's been suggested here that you can configure Vista, much like XP, to run as fast as you want it to.  I've
tweaked Vista Premium on this Acer Aspire to run blazingly fast, mainly following suggestions at Black Viper's
website and at various other "windows/vista tweaking/tips and tricks" sites.

It's simple, step-by-step stuff to get the bloat and adware and (some!) unnecessary security  and background
services, etc out of operation so that your laptop OS is quick and responsive.

But of course, I finally purchased a spare hard drive so that I can run Vector when I feel like it, too.   ;)
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: ekp on July 17, 2007, 08:16:58 pm
(from the first post) "..I hate looking at an LCD and all the power sucking programs running in the background.."

I'm sure it's been suggested here that you can configure Vista, much like XP, to run as fast as you want it to.  I've
tweaked Vista Premium on this Acer Aspire to run blazingly fast, mainly following suggestions at Black Viper's
website and at various other "windows/vista tweaking/tips and tricks" sites.

It's simple, step-by-step stuff to get the bloat and adware and (some!) unnecessary security  and background
services, etc out of operation so that your laptop OS is quick and responsive.

But of course, I finally purchased a spare hard drive so that I can run Vector when I feel like it, too.   ;)

Well it is nice to get so much input.  I agree with the posts that state clueless operators run a lot of security they do not need.  This is my daughters first computer and no one touches it.  She feels the need at this point to run all the Norton Security programs.  If it were mine I would also do away with most of the programs running in the background.  I have not used Windows for probably ten years and have got used to not needing such stuff.  I hear only horror stories from other users about spyware invading system and such.  I myself had never had a virus.........check that ..I did have one attached to and email once.

I have not played with the desktop on my daughters computer or I would get all the trash off it.  I find my linux distros (currently SOHO 5.8) much cleaner and easier to use.  My wife has even become a convert.  All she has at work is Win2000.

If you are a graphics student then it is only Mac for you and LCD's do not render enough colors so CRT's are the only way to go.  I find resolution on LCD's lacking.  I must admit though I have only seen Windows systems on LCD's and I think Linux renders better anyway.

These are my opinions only and management is not responsible for content.
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: nubcnubdo on July 17, 2007, 08:35:17 pm
Suggestion: Get rid of Norton Security (uninstall it). Use instead the following freeware:

1. AVG Free - antivirus
http://www.download.com/3000-2239_4-10703202.html

2. Spybot Search & Destroy - spyware remover
http://www.safer-networking.org/en/mirrors/index.html

3. Ad-Aware 2007 free - spyware remover
http://www.download.com/3000-2144-10045910.html

4. ZoneAlarm free - software firewall
http://www.pcworld.com/downloads/file/fid,7228-order,1-page,1-c,firewalls/description.html
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: Lyn on July 18, 2007, 01:10:48 am
That is good advice, Norton is just so heavy weight - it can slow down a computer to a crawl.  Better the light weight programs suggested.
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: tomh38 on July 18, 2007, 07:05:45 am
Another antivirus application that's free (GPL Free!) is ClamWin, which is ClamAv using Cygwin to run in Windows.  You don't have to install any Cygwin files, ClamWin does all that for you.

When ever I work on somebody's Windows machine, I install ClamWin.  I think it works at least as well as any of the proprietary antivirus programs out there, certainly better that crappy Norton.
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: exeterdad on July 18, 2007, 09:55:37 am
Some good advise here!  My mother in laws laptop has Norton's and some other bloat that completely slows down startup.  Her "subscriptions" have expired so they aren't any use (she won't be able to afford to renew them right now).  Yet they still have to load up.  I've been itching for the chance of ripping that crap out of the laptop.  Now is my chance since freeware is available. 

Thanks a bunch!
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: nubcnubdo on July 18, 2007, 09:58:33 am
Norton: nag, nag, nag
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: Triarius Fidelis on July 18, 2007, 10:31:40 am
A problem I have with most laptops is the use of black or dark-colored keyboards. I like to rely on ambient light in my house, and this light isnt sufficient to illuminate letters on a black keyboard, since black reflects very little light. In contrast, a beige, silver, or light-colored keyboard reflects sufficient light from the room to provides its own illumination, and doesnt require direct lighting.

Consequently, I must have near perfect lighting to see the letters on the black keyboard of a typical laptop, the best illumination being direct lighting which is undesired. USB lights are a response to this illumination problem on a black keyboard. OTOH, I can read letters on a beige keyboard in a dimly lit room because the lighter color reflects more light and provides better illumination and contrast for the black letters.

Set your desktop background to pure white. It's sufficient to read by.
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: lagagnon on July 18, 2007, 11:10:45 am
I've been itching for the chance of ripping that crap out of the laptop...
Well said. I get a lot of requests to tune up slow Windows systems and the first thing I do is remove Norton/Symantec stuff and install the apps suggested by nubcnubdo above. The latter is just way too resource intensive, invasive and expensive. Everything software should not be!
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: nubcnubdo on July 18, 2007, 08:35:08 pm
Hanumizzle says:
Quote
Set your desktop background to pure white. It's sufficient to read by.

My primary objective is to use only reflected light, so looking into a bright white screen would be just as undesirable as direct lighting (if not worse). I know what youre saying, that's about what I do: I tilt the screen forward so it illuminates the keyboard.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=40Olv8kqxIk
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: exeterdad on July 20, 2007, 04:31:47 am
Quote
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=40Olv8kqxIk

What an amazing piece!  Someone you know?
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: MikeCindi on July 20, 2007, 09:31:14 pm
I guess this thread has strayed a bit but...I first heard PK in 1978 and have more than enjoyed his music since. I seen him live several times.
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: gacl on July 20, 2007, 10:56:50 pm
Speaking of desktops and notebooks, this article says that soon in the US more notebooks will be sold than desktops. And that this has already happened in Japan ( for years ) and Western Europe ( last year ). It is estimated that by 2010  the notebook will overtake the desktop in sales worldwide.

http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic&articleId=9027439&intsrc=hm_ts_head (http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic&articleId=9027439&intsrc=hm_ts_head)
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: tomh38 on July 22, 2007, 09:32:06 am
You can have my desktop when you pry it from my cold, dead ... oh, never mind.

I expect that laptops will become easier to use and repair as they become more prevalent.  I just hope it doesn't get to the point where I can't get the parts to build my own machine anymore.  That would be a sad day for me.

Tom
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: Kocil on July 22, 2007, 08:27:00 pm
I just hope it doesn't get to the point where I can't get the parts to build my own machine anymore.  That would be a sad day for me.

That will happen, unfortunatelly.
Read these
http://today.java.net/pub/a/today/2004/09/09/blacksmith.html
http://today.java.net/pub/a/today/2004/09/28/Blacksmith2.html
http://today.java.net/pub/a/today/2004/10/12/Blacksmith3.html

Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: The Headacher on July 23, 2007, 12:56:22 am
I just hope it doesn't get to the point where I can't get the parts to build my own machine anymore.  That would be a sad day for me.

That will happen, unfortunatelly.
I don't think so, there will always be people who want a modular computer, so you can upgrade something whenever you want. Newer computers will be so complex not one manufacturer can develop all the parts needed and assemble them into some ugly non-modular design. Also, it's much easier for manufacturers to build computers from off the shelf parts than it is to build your own hardware. You can't just decide to build your own videocards as a computer manufacturer, unless you're one of the really big ones. It would still not be economical, as they don't have the knowhow that intel, ATI and Nvidia do.
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: rbistolfi on July 23, 2007, 05:11:29 am
hmm, may be if the manufacturers make some kind of fusion in order to build a monopoly... I guess we will need to find parts on the garbage. Is hard to predict. When several companies are joined in a side, in order to build a more powerful an with a better integrated solution; in the meanwhile others are geting modular and being splited, in order to be more efficient. It's some kind of circle, I guess.
PS: That was interesting reading, kocil, thanks. I dont agree with author though.
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: GrannyGeek on July 23, 2007, 09:17:43 am
Just because laptop sales are increasing and passing desktop sales does not mean desktop computers are on the way out. It will take many years before we have an idea of where things are heading in real life. In the mean time, desktops are more powerful than laptops at the same price point, desktops can be repaired much more easily, builds, repairs, and upgrades can be done by non-technical people, repairs on a desktop cost much less, and using a real keyboard and looking at a real monitor bigger than any laptop screen are still important factors in the laptop vs. desktop decision.

It's not either/or. A serious computer user will probably want both. As prices keep falling, you don't have to be wealthy to have both.

Smartphones will replace laptops to some extent. It's much easier to carry a small smartphone than even the lightest notebook computer. Even my aging PDA can do some of the things I'd use a computer for, and it has no phone and no wireless in it. It can do Office-compatible word processing and spreadsheets, and if I actually had to do these things on the road I'd get a keyboard for it. I don't need to do those things, so the PDA's "soft keyboard" and Graffiti writing are sufficient for my needs. If my PDA did wireless I could do my e-mail and Web browsing at any hot spot. Listen to music, look at photos, check my calendar, keep my address book--I can do all of these on a small device.

I have no idea what the next ten years will bring. I hope I'm still around to see it!
--GrannyGeek
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: rbistolfi on July 23, 2007, 11:53:03 am
I agree about desktops have long life, and laptops are good machines if you need/want a computer with you all the time. But I think we can doubt about the tomh38 concerning. Hardware manufacturers monopolizing computer parts is not an impossible future. Improbable, but not impossible, the users, the laws, needs to to work to avoid that chance in the future.
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: tomh38 on July 24, 2007, 06:12:30 am
Good points, everyone.  My gut tells me that in the near future (5-10 years) desktop hardware will be available more on the net and less in brick-and-mortar shops, since Best Buy, CompUSA, Fry's, etc. are struggling.  I already buy most of my hardware online, and only buy something at CompUSA if I need it immediately.  I agree with GrannyGeek and The Headacher that for the foreseeable future there will be a demand for modular design and that with laptops and desktops it's not an either/or scenario.  Automobiles have been coming off the assembly line for 100 years now, but there are still a few people who build/rebuild cars.  Also, servers need to be customized for the needs of business (often - I've put together a few myself), and most machines that can work as a server can work as a workstation.  My current main machine lives in a mini-server case, which I bought along with the best power supply and cooling system I could find so that I could stuff all the hardware I want to in there and not worry about space or airflow.  As long as the ATX form factor remains standard for PCs, I should be able to use this case indefinitely.  When I bought it all the off-the-shelf desktops were beige, but my case was black.  Now everything is black, grey, and silver.  Anyway, if manufacturers stop making PC hardware available to individuals, I'm going to buy up as many PCs as I can find and build a Beowulf cluster in my basement and connect a thin client to it upstairs.  That should keep me current for a few years.  After that, computers will be the size of tic-tacs and the interface will be through the brainstem.  Once that happens, I'll buy a shotgun and go live in a cabin in the woods.  I'll be seeing all of you in some virtuality where you can look like whatever you want.  I'll be the incredibly handsome guy with a perfectly sculpted body, every superpower of every superhero, and a ginormous ****.  I suspect I'll be one of millions like that.
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: exeterdad on July 24, 2007, 06:29:32 am
*headsmack*  That boy ain't right.

lol
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: gacl on July 24, 2007, 08:37:02 am
Quote
tomh38: I already buy most of my hardware online

I once needed a USB cable ( male-to-male, i think ) and went to CompUSA to get it. The cheapest one was 26 dollars ( ! ). I went online and found it for 3. The internet is a god-send for cheap-skates poor people like me.
Title: Re: Keep your laptop and Vista both.
Post by: Triarius Fidelis on July 25, 2007, 10:40:51 am
I'll be the incredibly handsome guy with a perfectly sculpted body, every superpower of every superhero, and a ginormous ****.  I suspect I'll be one of millions like that.

My avatar would be:

(http://img-fan.theonering.net/rolozo/images/rouillard/gothmog_thro.jpg)