VectorLinux

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

Visit our home page for VL info. For support and documentation, visit the Vector Linux Knowledge Center or search the Knowledge Center and this Forum using the search box above.

Pages: 1 ... 7 8 [9] 10 11 ... 14

Author Topic: VL pre-installed  (Read 76533 times)

rbistolfi

  • Packager
  • Vectorian
  • ****
  • Posts: 2383
Re: VL pre-installed
« Reply #120 on: May 17, 2007, 02:22:53 pm »

I agree with both, Granny and Bigpaws. You are rigth about those distros, Granny. But I pick Linex as an example because it already have a lot of tools for small bussisnes out of the box, like Facturaplus (a stock manager). And you are rigth about SOHO too, it is for small office, but there is no action to make small offices get noticed about that, something like "hey, oficce man! I have the solution for you!". Slackware is adaptable to a small enterprise needs, but by you and me (well, not me), I dont think a business man could do it, so, here is VL doing for him.
Another option is to get an strategic partner to make an integral product. Like a hardware provider, a web designer, a database developer. In that way you can offer a product that include everything a small office needs out of the box. I mean the hard, the soft, the look, the server solution, the management solution, etc.
Bigpaws, you are rigth about there is no strong app for cad on linux, and I think linux is not fully ready for the desktop battle, we need to keep this in mind, because I think other linux enterprises lost the way here, like RedHat. Linux is not ready, but is in the way. One step is looking the rigth place in the market, I am sure there is a place for linux desktops there, like the restaurants Bigpaws said. 

Quote
grisby, kmymoney and gnucash (a dependency hog IMHO) are not an option, because accountants
want Quickbooks and that is all.

I think an enterprise working well needs a custom app for that. I work for a small business and in my experience, there is no standard solutions in this.  That is the reason because i think a "database developer" could be a good partner. You can make a product with low cost, and great added value.
« Last Edit: May 17, 2007, 03:15:46 pm by rbistolfi »
Logged
"There is a concept which corrupts and upsets all others. I refer not to Evil, whose limited realm is that of ethics; I refer to the infinite."
Jorge Luis Borges, Avatars of the Tortoise.

--
Jumalauta!!

metvas

  • Vectorite
  • ***
  • Posts: 314
Re: VL pre-installed
« Reply #121 on: May 17, 2007, 02:29:05 pm »

We interrupt this broadcast to bring you the latest developments
Vector Linux Soho v5.8 Gold is available on line at Madtux along with the VL Box(s),
Way to go… TEAM…Just lovin in Linux. Press release of our partnership or maybe alliance with MadTux should hit the net by tomorrow. After the roller coaster ride that the last 10 days has brought my skin is THICK. Post what you would like, sky is the limit right now. We can go (within reason), ANYWHERE. Next absolute necessity to FOCUS on is the Pre-Paid help APP. This is a must do.
Thanks and congratulations to ALL…WELL DONE. I am very proud of the whole TEAM…as is Madtux
Regards
Darrell
Logged
Knowledge is Power, share it.
Be the change you want to see in the World

bigpaws

  • Administrator
  • Vectorian
  • *****
  • Posts: 1892
Re: VL pre-installed
« Reply #122 on: May 17, 2007, 04:11:06 pm »

The suggestions of starting a Ticket type system is great. I have been researched most
of them to date. The results are:

Open Ticket
Promise for Version 2.0 since 11/05 and not produced I would consider it dead

Trellis Ticket promising until you get to the licensing it is free but not open source and there
is no allowance for modification. That presents a problem for even changing small things.

Request-Tracker shows real promise however installation is far from easy. There is a long
history and support forum. The forum is active and most of the documentation is complete. This is written in Perl.

Eticket exeterdad posted on the 13th of trying to get a server going for a demo. He did mention that
he is busy. Last release was 4-11-07 so appears to be a current project. It appears to be a one person
show not that it should deter its' use. I do note sparse documentation. Again that can be resolved. Based on PHP.

There are the results. Any other suggestions or comments will be more than welcomed.

Bigpaws
Logged

nubcnubdo

  • Vectorian
  • ****
  • Posts: 675
Re: VL pre-installed
« Reply #123 on: May 17, 2007, 04:19:27 pm »

OneOrZero:

http://www.oneorzero.com/

The OneOrZero Task Management and Help Desk System is a powerful, enterprise grade task management and help desk application.

It is fast, customizable and runs on virtually any platform and is released under the General Public Licence (GPL) Open Source license, allowing you to customize freely.

Our experienced and highly skilled team also offer support and customization services, to ensure your OneOrZero installation is professionally supported.

Main Features:
http://www.oneorzero.com/?controller=main_general&option=main_features

« Last Edit: May 17, 2007, 04:31:47 pm by nubcnubdo »
Logged

rbistolfi

  • Packager
  • Vectorian
  • ****
  • Posts: 2383
Re: VL pre-installed
« Reply #124 on: May 17, 2007, 05:07:59 pm »

I think the Trellis license allow modifications, but not allow the re-ditribution of the modificated version.

Quote
You may:
* Modify and customize the software to your personal liking except to the extent detailed in this agreement.

I read the license and I didnt found anything but:

Quote
You may not:
(...)
* Reverse engineer, disassemble, or create derivative works based on the software for distribution or usage outside your website.

Please correct me if I am wrong, may be I missed something.

OneOrZero:

http://www.oneorzero.com/

The OneOrZero Task Management and Help Desk System is a powerful, enterprise grade task management and help desk application.

It is fast, customizable and runs on virtually any platform and is released under the General Public Licence (GPL) Open Source license, allowing you to customize freely.

Our experienced and highly skilled team also offer support and customization services, to ensure your OneOrZero installation is professionally supported.

Main Features:
http://www.oneorzero.com/?controller=main_general&option=main_features



Look nice too, I need to see it more foundly...
Logged
"There is a concept which corrupts and upsets all others. I refer not to Evil, whose limited realm is that of ethics; I refer to the infinite."
Jorge Luis Borges, Avatars of the Tortoise.

--
Jumalauta!!

bigpaws

  • Administrator
  • Vectorian
  • *****
  • Posts: 1892
Re: VL pre-installed
« Reply #125 on: May 17, 2007, 05:33:02 pm »

Quote
I think the Trellis license allow modifications, but not allow the re-ditribution of the modificated version.

Quote
You may:
* Modify and customize the software to your personal liking except to the extent detailed in this agreement.

I read the license and I didnt found anything but:

Here is the whole license:
Quote
"Modify and/or remove any copyright notices or labels on the software on each page (unless copyright output removal license is purchased) and in the header of each script source file. This includes, but is not restricted to, deleting, moving, changing the size, removing the links, or deleting any words from the copyright noticies
* Distribute any of the files or any part of the files contained in the software package (except skin and language files)."

What is highlighted is the problem. You could not modify the page to say Vector Linux, egroupware,phpproject and
opengroupware because of the gpl you could do that.

Bigpaws
Logged

rbistolfi

  • Packager
  • Vectorian
  • ****
  • Posts: 2383
Re: VL pre-installed
« Reply #126 on: May 17, 2007, 06:25:31 pm »

hmmm, I can see it now, I thougt that meaning something different, like this: "you cant remove the copyrigth notice wich is located on the header of each source file". Sorry  :-[
Logged
"There is a concept which corrupts and upsets all others. I refer not to Evil, whose limited realm is that of ethics; I refer to the infinite."
Jorge Luis Borges, Avatars of the Tortoise.

--
Jumalauta!!

exeterdad

  • Packager
  • Vectorian
  • ****
  • Posts: 2046
Re: VL pre-installed
« Reply #127 on: May 18, 2007, 08:43:13 pm »

I thought I'd contact the authors of Trellis and find out what we could do to Trellis.  I opened up a help ticket and communicated through the help system they had set up.  It sent copies of everything to my email as well.  Pretty cool.  Okay this is the correspondence.

Me:
Quote
Hello,

My name is Lee. I am a member of the VectorLinux community. VectorLinux is based upon Slackware Linux if you aren't familiar.

The reason I am contacting you is we are now looking for a Help Desk solution to offer premium support to our users. Normally we have outstanding support free to all within in our own forums, but recently MadTux has started selling new computers with VectorLinux preloaded on them. They are also selling these customers subscription based support. They (MadTux) gave us the opportunity to staff that support, or they would handle it themselves. As VectorLinux is our design, we feel the customers would be better served by the creators rather than a third party. This also means that VectorLinux will have the chance to earn a trivial amount of money, helping to pay for server costs or promotion.

Though your help desk solution is beautiful and functional we would have to alter it to suite our needs. Though we see no need to remove the small copyright text, we would like to change the Trellis Desk logo on the upper right to our own logo. We believe you and your team deserve credit for what appears to be a promising product.

Code modification's would definitely be source code modifications. We would have to implement some sort of PayPal gateway, a gateway for what MadTux has sold and something to track the status of subscriptions.

We have no intentions of redistributing the code we modify. We are simply asking permission to alter Trellis Desk for our own use.

Also... honestly. Do you think Trellis Desk is suited for a production yet.

Your reply is anxiously awaited.

Regards,
Lee

Them:
Quote
Hello Lee,

Thanks for your kind words regarding Trellis Desk. You can modify Trellis Desk in any way you want; source code, images, css, templates, language, etc. However, the copyright at the bottom must remain intact. If you wish to remove the copyright, I would be more than happy to allow you to do so for a one-time fee.

As for your last question, honestly, I think Trellis Desk is currently stable enough for small to medium sized organizations / companies. However, Beta 5 has some email notification bugs and statistics features are still being added. So if email notification and/or statistics is important to you, I would wait until Beta 6 which should be released in about a week or two. Statistics will actually take a little longer. Probably the following release or two.

Otherwise, Beta 5 is pretty stable. If I were you, I would wait until Beta 6 is released, and just do a fresh install from that. Of course, you could always download Beta 5 and play around with it. Also, if you were to upgrade from Beta 5 to Beta 6, you would have to redo some of your modifications as files will need to be overwritten. As always, please remember this software is in beta. It is not guaranteed to be stable. Based on user feedback, most of our builds have been pretty stable. We haven't had any major disasters yet. :P

If you have any more questions, please don't hesitate to ask. Again, Beta 6 will be out soon. It's going through private testing right now. :)

And me again:
Quote
Thank you for your informative and speedy response. Also your brutal
honestly about the status of your project. I will post our
correspondence on our message board and leave it to the community to
decide. There has been debate whether or not your license would allow
modifications to the code. You have cleared that up.

I will personally let you know if your system is used on our site.

Regards,

Lee

That's nice to know!  Anyhow to keep people up to speed.  It appears it hasn't been decided what system to use.  Bigpaws and I have been searching out and playing with other systems, and trying to weigh pros and cons.  Bigpaws say other members are working on this too.
Logged

rbistolfi

  • Packager
  • Vectorian
  • ****
  • Posts: 2383
Re: VL pre-installed
« Reply #128 on: May 19, 2007, 08:35:42 am »

Good job exeterdad! I am testing some tools on my xampp server too, and a I must to say Trellis is the winner for me. The lack of stats is not a good notice, could be really helpful in order to know how many jobs are taken by each member of the staff, but may be we can find a solution for this.
The best feature is the "groups" one. I created 3 custom groups. One called "30 days", other called "6 months", other "1 year". I thougth VL could offer more than a "30 days service". We can create custom groups to match all kind of support-products VL could offer. Then I wrote a very simple php script to delete all the "expired" members. It works like this: If you are a member of the "30 days" groups, and 30 days passed after de subscription, then you are deleted from the database. And one of these for each group. The script is not a modification to the source code, it works with the mysql database directly, using the fields "joined" and "mgroup" of the xx_members table (xx_ is the prefix). This script could be non-interactive and be executed as a cron job daily, by the php interpreter. I tested it adding several members on different dates. I will keep testing it to look if nothing else get corrupted on the database, but looks like its working.
I am thinking in adding another group called "inactive" with no permissions at all, so we can "move" the expired members to thart group, and not delete them, since the delete has no undo. Is much as the original script, but using UPDATE instead the DELETE sql instruction.
I think a gateaway could be implemented in a similar way, working directly with the database and not touching trellis at all.
Is true this tools can be implemented with other help-desk, but Trellis already have all what we need to do it.
I will keep on this...
cheers, Rodrigo
Logged
"There is a concept which corrupts and upsets all others. I refer not to Evil, whose limited realm is that of ethics; I refer to the infinite."
Jorge Luis Borges, Avatars of the Tortoise.

--
Jumalauta!!

bigpaws

  • Administrator
  • Vectorian
  • *****
  • Posts: 1892
Re: VL pre-installed
« Reply #129 on: May 19, 2007, 12:03:31 pm »

Quote
Then I wrote a very simple php script to delete all the "expired" members. It works like this: If you are a member of the "30 days" groups, and 30 days passed after de subscription, then you are deleted from the database

Are you refering to actually deleting the table entries? If that is the case the you can create a couple problems one is that
reindexing of MySQL db will need to be done after the batch delete. The other problem is that deleting the information
of course will limit the available statistics, so no query.

Bigpaws
Logged

MikeCindi

  • Tester
  • Vectorian
  • ****
  • Posts: 1083
Re: VL pre-installed
« Reply #130 on: May 19, 2007, 12:27:55 pm »

The script surely could be modified to "move" the expired account to the "expired" group. Of course that group would no longer have access to the subscription service but would still be in the database for statistical information and queries.
Logged
The plans of the diligent lead to profit...Pro. 21:5
 VL64 7.1                                     RLU 486143

exeterdad

  • Packager
  • Vectorian
  • ****
  • Posts: 2046
Re: VL pre-installed
« Reply #131 on: May 19, 2007, 08:50:35 pm »

rbistolfi...  you're off to a rock'n start!  I like the idea of messing with the source as little as possible.  Would make upgrading to another release of Trellis less painful.  And we know it would have to happen to get the bugfixes taken care of, and the stats when they are implemented.

I admit I've done little today as far as looking in to all this.  The wife hates staring at the back of my head when I have my nose buried in computer related stuff.  I wasn't about to push my luck today.  I'm sure the married folks around here know the deal.

I did however notice something disturbing about Trellis.  I fired off one more response to the fellow I was conversing with.  All correspondence to him was via the helpdesk using the browser.  This last response was by email.  I did it purposely to see if it would work.  It failed.  I did receive a message from his mail server:
Code: [Select]
This is an automatically generated Delivery Status Notification

Delivery to the following recipient failed permanently:

    support@iftomatoes.com

Technical details of permanent failure:
PERM_FAILURE: SMTP Error (state 13): 550-"The recipient cannot be verified.  Please check all recipients of this
550 message to verify they are valid."
And then the remainder was the headers and the message I had sent.  Keep in mind that this was the actual Trellis Desk help system that the author uses.  Not the demo they have set up.  Though he did warn me that the current release is buggy in the mail functions and they should be resolved in the next release that is under testing.  Hopefully that server isn't one of the testing servers!

I am curious what bigpaws conclusion may be about the otrs system?
Logged

bigpaws

  • Administrator
  • Vectorian
  • *****
  • Posts: 1892
Re: VL pre-installed
« Reply #132 on: May 19, 2007, 09:24:47 pm »

Quote
I am curious what bigpaws conclusion may be about the otrs system?

The OTRS system is an incredible system that can used via browser or email. I tested the email
system and had sucess then only  quirks were the first email I sent to them arrived last. That could
be a flakey email system on my ISP part.

The problrm or may I say the challenge so far has been getting the beast installed. I have tried
Debian based installs without success. I am working on a Slackware install at the moment.

Oh and the current test server for Trellis is quoted by them to be on the Beta 6 as of last night.

Bigpaws
Logged

exeterdad

  • Packager
  • Vectorian
  • ****
  • Posts: 2046
Re: VL pre-installed
« Reply #133 on: May 19, 2007, 10:18:47 pm »

Found a surprise in my email a bit ago from the guy from Trellis Desk:
Quote
Hello Lee,

Sounds good. I couldn't help but notice you mentioned that you received an error when sending email an email to support@iftomatoes.com. (I found your forums and your the topic in which you are discussing Trellis Desk. It's interesting to see what you guys have to say and great feedback for me.) Anyways, we currently do not have support@iftomatoes.com setup to receive any emails. That's why you received the error. It was actually generated by the server mail program, not Trellis Desk.

What gave to you idea to try support@iftomatoes.com? Did you find that email somewhere on our website? I'm just curious because it might be out there somewhere when it shouldn't be. Anyways, this system is now running Beta 6, which has all known email issues resolved. :P

Sorry for eavesdropping on you guys. But I always like to read stuff about Trellis Desk on other websites. Great feedback tool, and it kinda inspires me. :)

What seems to of happened was I had attempted to contact him by replying to one of the emails sent out by the help system.  I'm guessing support@iftomatoes.com was filled in by the setup script and wasn't edited to reflect a legitimate email address on the mail server.
Logged

rbistolfi

  • Packager
  • Vectorian
  • ****
  • Posts: 2383
Re: VL pre-installed
« Reply #134 on: May 20, 2007, 02:53:41 pm »

Quote
Then I wrote a very simple php script to delete all the "expired" members. It works like this: If you are a member of the "30 days" groups, and 30 days passed after de subscription, then you are deleted from the database

Are you refering to actually deleting the table entries? If that is the case the you can create a couple problems one is that
reindexing of MySQL db will need to be done after the batch delete. The other problem is that deleting the information
of course will limit the available statistics, so no query.

Bigpaws

The delete was the first thing to try, I re-wrote the script to move the expired user to another group, instead the hard delete. I am not a pgp* php expert, but I thougth some reaserch on this field could help us. I was looking the source code and I cant find yet the way trellis handle the delete/move-to-other-group action, inj order of do it in a similar way, because we dont want to corrupt the database. If I am not wrong, the xx_members table is a fundamental one, and it is not related with others. That is good, so we could safely modify entrys without errors, if the table would be related (via the FOREING KEY option by example) we could not modify it easily.

I noticed the reindexing issue, but this jobe needs to be done if the database is edited by the trellis software too. I am looking into the source code, but is a little complex to me. If we could find the exact way trellis handles this issues, we could reproduce them in our script.

Quote
I like the idea of messing with the source as little as possible.  Would make upgrading to another release of Trellis less painful.
You are totally rigth about this. Upgrade a very tweaked code could be a big problem in the future. I think the key to do it ios understanding the source code very well, and try to do things in a similar way, but "from the outside".

Quote
Sorry for eavesdropping on you guys. But I always like to read stuff about Trellis Desk on other websites. Great feedback tool, and it kinda inspires me.

You are welcome here, please notice the "manage expired users" feature could be a nice improvement to the system  ;)

Quote
The OTRS system is an incredible system that can used via browser or email.
A system wich can be operated via email is really nice. I was looking the demo and didnt notice an easy way to manage the members, this could be a problem to us, in order to implement all the features we need. But I didnt look at it in a deep way, just the first impression. I will try an install on my xampp if I can make the time.

*oops, a typo
« Last Edit: May 20, 2007, 06:05:28 pm by rbistolfi »
Logged
"There is a concept which corrupts and upsets all others. I refer not to Evil, whose limited realm is that of ethics; I refer to the infinite."
Jorge Luis Borges, Avatars of the Tortoise.

--
Jumalauta!!
Pages: 1 ... 7 8 [9] 10 11 ... 14