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[bigpaws]

using the shell means that the user should learn the command line of the search tool and type everything,which slows down the process of accessing files.

This is certainly not always true. When the concepts are learned then
typing locate *.jpg | grep grape is not that hard, vs (using Uelsk8s example)
click on app link, then enter the name, and then where to search, then which
search tool.

CLI is not bad, it is simplicity. The beauty of Slackware or Vector is an old
Linux book is still useable. Vector is great for old hardware as well as it is
great for older books. RedHat and Ubuntu can not really claim that. Slackware
and Vector keep it clean and simple.

Bigpaws

[rbistolfi]

Ok, I think is time to stop the ball and think a little . Every distro wants to be user friendly and easy to learn for newbies. And we want to do that with out losing the unix bases and keeping the vl's goals intact.
Clearly, the limit is hard to find and some points or topics will be polemic. We need to find a balance and state what things we are able to do in order to be more user friendly and what things we wont do ever. We know all the guys here means well, and I think nobody suggested the opposite in this thread.

About this particular thing. The perfect app would be one that doesnt run as a daemon but keeps and updated database all the time. That would be one like picasa2 for photos, i.e. not runs as a daemon, but index new files at start up. is there something like that? A frontend for locate which runs updatedb at start up would work, imho.

[GrannyGeek]

When the concepts are learned then
typing locate *.jpg | grep grape is not that hard

It is for me. "Locate" I can handle, but start throwing in a grep and I'm lost. I simply can't remember that stuff. And I have a lot more technical proficiency than an "average user."

CLI is not bad, it is simplicity.

Certainly not bad, but simplicity? Not to me. I can't remember those commands, and throw in a bunch of parameters and it's a hopeless case for me.

I'm certainly not suggesting that VectorLinux should make all GUI tools the goal or the default. I just think a reality check about how "average users" relate to command lines is in order.
--GrannyGeek

[lighans]

It is for me. "Locate" I can handle, but start throwing in a grep and I'm lost. I simply can't remember that stuff. And I have a lot more technical proficiency than an "average user."

CLI is not bad, it is simplicity.

I'm certainly not suggesting that VectorLinux should make all GUI tools the goal or the default. I just think a reality check about how "average users" relate to command lines is in order.
--GrannyGeek

I'm happy to hear this, GrannyGeek. I recognize your words. Locate something is long enough command for me. I wonder how to automatic update the database? -h doesn't help because of the strange complex answer.
On the other hand VL makes a nice combination of cli and mc which works terrific for me. the F2 menu makes me feel like using the cli.
So what if we can do terminal, mc, and a search command under the usermenu?
The contradiction for me is that I use VL because of speed and simplicity, except a bit minimalistic approach and want to feel in control. but also knowing that other things in life take time, so learning and diving into the deep blue see of possibilities of linux is too much for me.

[saulgoode]

I'm happy to hear this, GrannyGeek. I recognize your words. Locate something is long enough command for me. I wonder how to automatic update the database? -h doesn't help because of the strange complex answer.

Run 'updatedb' (as root). I think it is already set up as a nightly cron job so it only becomes necessary to update if you are locating more recent files.

If you mean automatically update each time you run locate, that would be a bad idea (updating takes a couple of minutes or more).

[GrannyGeek]

On the other hand VL makes a nice combination of cli and mc which works terrific for me. the F2 menu makes me feel like using the cli.

I *love* Midnight Commander and wish new users were more aware of its power and simplicity. It's such a nice front end to commands like chown and chmod and so many others without the GUI overload. I haven't even begun to make full use of it, because in the on-disk manual there are so many possibilities. For example, you can set up shortcut keys to your most frequently accessed directories, which can save tons of time and keystrokes. I had a nice set of shortcuts on a previous VL installation, but I still haven't gotten around to setting up shortcuts on my current installations.
--GrannyGeek

[lagagnon]

I *love* Midnight Commander and wish new users were more aware of its power and simplicity.

I agree. The F2 menu is also fully customizable (mc.menu) and the "man mc" manual page is probably one of the most comprehensive and easiest to read man pages in the Unix world. mc is also usable from a non-GUI login so is great for repairing faulty systems and it is included in almost every Linux distro (except Ubuntu!).

[blurymind]

using the shell means that the user should learn the command line of the search tool and type everything,which slows down the process of accessing files.

This is certainly not always true. When the concepts are learned then
typing locate *.jpg | grep grape is not that hard, vs (using Uelsk8s example)
click on app link, then enter the name, and then where to search, then which
search tool.

CLI is not bad, it is simplicity. The beauty of Slackware or Vector is an old
Linux book is still useable. Vector is great for old hardware as well as it is
great for older books. RedHat and Ubuntu can not really claim that. Slackware
and Vector keep it clean and simple.

Bigpaws

the best search tool is the one that lets the user access a file, only by clicking 3 or 4 buttons of his keyboard...and also lets the user search for the file on the internet or execute a command...
doing this the cli way would mean more actions:
open terminal
type command
think right parameters to command
access file wityh more commands or browse to them with file browser
...these are LOTS of actions. As i said before, not only locating the file,but quickly accessing it important.Very quickly.
 basically,i think that gnome's deskbar is the best one around,because it is also configurable...but it is very heavy (and bloated by default).

I agree vec should be kept clean and simple, its what kept it good during the years. Its light as a feather and stable as a rock.

[VgnFrnd]

I know this thread has been dormant for almost one year, but I would like to add my $0.02 anyway: KFind is a part of the KDE suite. As far as I know, it is installed by default on any kde installation. KFind can search for words, phrases, and strings within the following file types: Text, KWord, KPresenter, KSpread, OpenOffice.org Writer, OpenOffice.org Impress, and OpenOffice.org Calc. I use it to find references to topics within any of the several thousand .rtf files I have written. Admittedly, it would be nice to be able to search across PDFs, address books, and e-mail archives, but address books and e-mail archivers (at least) usually come with their own search engines, which leaves lacking only the ability to search for text across PDFs.

[blurymind]

that also means that you would have to use kde in order to use it. My idea for a search tool is something that immitates mac's finder/quicksilver, its light and its indexing daemon could be turned off,so it can be used as an application/file launcher.  (alt+space , type first two-three letters of the name,it guesses the rest,click enter and it launches)

Google desktop can do that,but its file indexing is somewhat slow.
they released launchy for linux- its a very nice application:
http://www.launchy.net/

[alec]

I use Google Desktop a lot, 95% for searching in pdf files. I only launch it when I need it, but it manages to keep index of all files anyway, without noticable slowdown. Memory footprint is very minor. It launches the file with one click. The "ctrl,ctrl" shortcut is the icing on the cake. Very fast and useful.
Kudos for having its package in the repo.

Edit. All said, I wouldn't want gdesktop to be default in vl. Just available from repo works best.
Meanwhile if catfish had tools to update database from gui...

[blurymind]

catfish is waaay less powerful than google desktop. It cannot launch applications,bookmarked websites or files from playlists.To find a file in it,you need to do more actions and its gui is cluttered.

googledesktop can even search text inside text files,pdf files and so on...

[blurymind]

this google tech talks video explains my idea about such a tool perfectly

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4LkTstvUL4&eurl=http://code.google.com/mac/

[alec]

but sometimes gdesktop is too powerful. When you're looking for a filename, it will clutter you with similar results from contents of different files.