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Author Topic: Forms  (Read 2547 times)
sledgehammer
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Posts: 1423



« on: October 16, 2007, 06:06:15 am »

More and more these days governments seem to be requiring the use of particular forms.  To apply for this.  To request that.  The courts are getting into the act as well.  A busy judge often wants all requests for a particular type of order to be in the same format, ergo the use of required forms.  California courts are very active in this area. 

Anyway, I recently needed to use a particular form which was supplied by a court in adobe "fill in" format, and, often as well, in Word Perfect format.  As Vector doesn't come with Adobe, I ended up saving the pdf form onto my computer and then manually filling it out with flpsed.  Fine, except the printed version contained all the Adobe messages ("print," etc).  A bother, but not fatal.

So, when the Word Perfect format was not supplied, I put the pdf form into Gimp, copied the top part (form required user to input variable data below the top part), saved that to a jpeg file which I then inserted into the top portion of a Lyx document and, using the lyx Table machine, made my own form for the data I needed to put in below the jpeg stuff.  Rather primative as the jpeg out of Gimp was sort of screwed up, but otherwise OK.  I am not good at Gimp.

I guess I could just download adobe reader and fill in the form online, but pissed at adobe as it won't port its fancy stuff to linux.  And I try not to fool around with programs that I can't get through gslapt.

End. 
« Last Edit: October 16, 2007, 06:35:43 am by lawquest » Logged

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bigpaws
Vectorian
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Posts: 1847


« Reply #1 on: October 16, 2007, 10:34:19 am »

I have felt your pain. Adobe Reader since 7.0 will allow you
to fill in forms. It is easy a straight forward install.

Bigpaws

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blurymind
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Posts: 1082



« Reply #2 on: October 16, 2007, 10:54:53 am »

crossoffice and wine support adobe's products pretty well... its on top of their compability priority lists actually..

Many people,uncomfortable with gimps somewhat basic gui,seek alternatives that resemble photoshop .. One being pixel image editor, which is a terrible piece of software actually.I found it very unusable.

Whatever we talk,photoshop will stay lightyears ahead of gimp, both with features and gui design.Its years ahead. Roll Eyes Its the muse for all other image editors.
I would like to see 1:1 photoshop clone with gimp's core. maybe not all the features,but really a copy of the user interface. And dont tell me gimpshop is that. It isnt that at all.They totally missed the point there!
Photoshop is comfortable because of its menu ordering,tool ordering,and screen space.
With gimp you open not one,but many windows,each over the other,in a different group.Its tabs are floating,taking too much space of the screen.Its right-click menu is terrible if you wanna draw with a tablet.In photoshop,when you click on the pen button (right click) you get a menu for the brush size.In gimp you get something you would get if you click elsewhere.Actually you get that in four places of the gimp's controls.Four.
gimp's dev surely arent thinking much about gui optimisation.With 2.4 they coppied some of photoshops tools,even added shortcut buttons for using some new actions,but thats still waaay behind what adobe devs did this far.Not to mention that it lacks layer subgroups.should be simple to implement,right?

gimpshop will never be an alternative to photoshop. Its not enough just to rename and reorder some of the menus. (things arent looking great with these pattent laws around)

Linux lacks professional graphic tools.Things are starting to look better when xaraLX was ported,with blender and gimp developing on the scene...but it still lacks all the new tools,which are hot atm.

I sure hope,adobe and the other big fishes on the software scene start noticing linux more...see linux as a bussiness partner,not as a hobby project. Maybe with novel,red hat or canonical pressuring them,and they feel they are losing from not investing in the linux port..maybe they will port it.Adobe's support for linux has always been terrible. I mean,we didnt even get to have flash player 8,they skipped that and for a long time,some sites couldnt be opened on a native linux web browser.People had to use IE+wine. Angry
« Last Edit: October 16, 2007, 11:09:32 am by blurymind » Logged

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exeterdad
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Posts: 2046



« Reply #3 on: October 16, 2007, 11:13:18 am »

Some people like Ford's, some Chevy's.  I love Gimp.  I disliked Photoshop even when I was a Window's user.
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rbistolfi
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Posts: 2282


« Reply #4 on: October 16, 2007, 11:41:27 am »

I think the app for the future would be one including photographic / drawing tools and vector graphics tools as well. Gimp and photoshop are not including those. Fireworks for windows does. I hope gimp will include more tools in the vector graphics area in the future. I am comfortable with gimp / inkscape for my small drawing jobs, though.

No idea about the forms issue, btw.
« Last Edit: October 16, 2007, 11:43:08 am by rbistolfi » Logged

"There is a concept which corrupts and upsets all others. I refer not to Evil, whose limited realm is that of ethics; I refer to the infinite."
Jorge Luis Borges, Avatars of the Tortoise.

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sledgehammer
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Posts: 1423



« Reply #5 on: October 16, 2007, 07:46:37 pm »

Bigpaws,

Does Adobe 7 allow you to fill in any PDF form, or is it necessary for the supplier of the form to first set the form up to take Adobe 7 input?

John
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bigpaws
Vectorian
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Posts: 1847


« Reply #6 on: October 16, 2007, 07:52:54 pm »

Good question.

The only forms that I have filled out with Adobe were
from the IRS. I do remember that there were 2 different
forms. On for editing and the other plain.

I hope that answers your question or at least helps.

Bigpaws
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carsten
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« Reply #7 on: October 16, 2007, 09:59:23 pm »

Hy together,
just to come back to the practical side:

I have to do with formulars at office and home sometimes as well. If I want to save the results instead of filling the template by hand (which is always the most easy and comfortable way) I take the formular as scan or file as full-scale-background to an  empty Open Office page. The requirred fields can be easily defined by textboxes.
In this way I can file it and re-use it.
Just a workaround  Wink
The next question should be why administrations enforce their clients (yes, we are their clients and not servants) to the usage of proprietar formats  Huh .
Just my . of view
Carsten
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Tam exacte ut oportet, non ut licet!
sledgehammer
Vectorian
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Posts: 1423



« Reply #8 on: October 16, 2007, 10:56:44 pm »

Great suggestion, carsten (using form as background).  I don't have open office loaded but same concept may work in abiword or lyx.  I will try it as time permits. 

John
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blurymind
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Posts: 1082



« Reply #9 on: October 17, 2007, 01:18:42 am »

I love gimp too, actually use it alot more that photoshop... but i saw that ps is more well crafted in gui and confortable to use. I mean, gimp is pretty clumsy in that direction.
>its toolbox has simular tools,which are listed sepparatedly. In photoshop,simular tools can be chosen from one toolbox button. This is to preserve space.
>Gimp's tabs cannot be resized more than a given value.They were created in a way that they take way too much space
>gimp opens everything in different windows, which makes it hard to navigate,if you have many things opened (check out the taskbar- in photoshop everything is in one window and it is set to float above the drawing board ,so other things cant cover them) In gimp i have to set everything on "always on top" when i go full screen.
>gimp doesnt have smooth zooming.
yeah,simple features,but they make life easier  Roll Eyes

oh and what you can do in photoshop with ctrl+t, you can do it with gimp by using a number of different tools,that basically do almost the same thing,but in different ways.Yes ,i mean transform.They can put it all in one tool,or subtool them on one button.
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sledgehammer
Vectorian
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Posts: 1423



« Reply #10 on: October 25, 2007, 07:04:20 am »

I am still working on Carsten's brilliant suggestion of importing an image as background.  Being unable to figure that out in lyx or abiword, I downloaded Open Office 2.2 and Carsten's idea works except very slowly on my machine (omnibook 900b laptop).

Open Office itself is not all that slow, once loaded. So I may be using the wrong image format.  I first converted the image to jpeg, using gimp.  Perhaps I had too many pixels or perhaps another format would have worked better?

It may be, as Carsten says, that filling the form out manually is better, but I am dealing with about 300 names and addresses that are in text format.  I would rather cut and paste rather than type them into the form.  Also, as they change from time to time, computerizing the operation seems specially prudent.

John
« Last Edit: October 25, 2007, 01:00:02 pm by lawquest » Logged

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rbistolfi
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Posts: 2282


« Reply #11 on: October 25, 2007, 07:21:21 am »

Hi lawquest, perhaps a little late, but this program came across to me:

http://www.accesspdf.com/pdftk/

maybe you want to give it a try.
What about exporting the pdf to html and fill the forms in a web browser? I dont know if that is possible, just an idea Sad

Update: the guy wrote a php script for that, I didn't try it yet but I think you might want to take a peek:
http://accesspdf.com/html_pdf_form/
« Last Edit: October 25, 2007, 07:40:47 am by rbistolfi » Logged

"There is a concept which corrupts and upsets all others. I refer not to Evil, whose limited realm is that of ethics; I refer to the infinite."
Jorge Luis Borges, Avatars of the Tortoise.

--
Jumalauta!!
sledgehammer
Vectorian
****
Posts: 1423



« Reply #12 on: October 25, 2007, 09:25:46 pm »

Thanks,

Due to time considerations, I think I will try this pdftk after finishing my current rush.  Importing the files into Open Office as gif seemed to speed things up quite a bit.  Still, no way to run a railroad.

John
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sledgehammer
Vectorian
****
Posts: 1423



« Reply #13 on: October 25, 2007, 11:24:41 pm »

The XML Forms gadget in Open Office is pretty slick.

John
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