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Author Topic: How to update Vector Light  (Read 8465 times)
edward
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« on: September 15, 2008, 03:02:20 pm »

Just installed Vector Light and am having a problem updating it.  When I launch Gslapt and click Update, the information files are downloaded, yet nothing is marked for update afterwards.


« Last Edit: September 16, 2008, 12:47:30 pm by edward » Logged
caitlyn
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« Reply #1 on: September 15, 2008, 03:22:58 pm »

You are misunderstanding how gslapt works.  Update only reads the repositories you have enabled and updates the available package list.  So what you describe means it's functioning properly.

What are you actually wanting to do?
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edward
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« Reply #2 on: September 15, 2008, 03:53:53 pm »

To update everything that was updated since 5.9 Light was released, security and otherwise.

I checked the repositories listing.  /packages, /extra and /testing were enabled.  /patches was not.  I enabled /patches and reloaded everything.  It still doesn't indicate anything that can be updated.  Items are either blue (installed) or white (not installed).



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caitlyn
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« Reply #3 on: September 15, 2008, 04:04:47 pm »

OK, you want to do a system wide upgrade.  First of all, disable testing unless you want breakage on your system.  Doing a system-wide upgrade with testing enabled is a recipe for disaster.  You want packages, patches, and extra enabled.

Now comes the bad news:  the VL developers DELIBERATELY disabled the functionality you want in gslapt.  They don't believe in doing system upgrades.  I disagree and have voiced that disagreement but I don't make decisions around here.  The net result is that you can't do it from the GUI.  You absolutely have to do it at the command line.  So, once patches are enabled and testing is disabled close gslapt, open a terminal window, become root using your choice of sudo or su, and then type in:

Code:
slapt-get --update
slapt-get --upgrade

That will do a full system upgrade.

Please wait about an hour before doing this.  I'm in the middle of doing some repository maintenance right now.  It will work now but you won't get a couple of updates that you will get later this evening.
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edward
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« Reply #4 on: September 15, 2008, 04:20:04 pm »


Now comes the bad news:  the VL developers DELIBERATELY disabled the functionality you want in gslapt.  They don't believe in doing system upgrades.  I disagree and have voiced that disagreement but I don't make decisions around here.  The net result is that you can't do it from the GUI. 

If the developers read this...

As a Vector newbie, I am also in disagreement with this. 

The users need to update using the easiest means possible, for most, that is the GUI.

By "upgrade", if that definition is upgrading from one version to another (e.g. 5.9 to 6.0), I would simply install the new version from scratch.  I once upgraded a different Linux distro instead of installing the new version from scratch and I ended up with a mix of old and new files.  It wasn't pretty...

Otherwise, if it is upgrading different packages that are part of the same version (5.9), this functionality also needs to be implemented.

Update and Upgrade could have two different definitions...

I enabled /testing because NTP was in that repository and I havbe always used NTP with Linux.  It has been disabled in the Gslapt settings and I'll try the command line items you specified.  Thank you for the help.  Smiley

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edward
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« Reply #5 on: September 15, 2008, 05:33:57 pm »

Updated the system according to caitlyn's instructions (disabled /testing, enabled /packages, /patches and /extra enabled.

System downloaded a bunch of updates.

Rebooted system.

NO DESKTOP

With the exception of the taskbar at the bottom of the screen, the rest of the desktop is black, no icons, no nothing.

See ya.
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caitlyn
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« Reply #6 on: September 15, 2008, 06:55:25 pm »

You know, I did a system upgrade to Light myself and it worked flawlessly.  I've NEVER heard of a problem like you describe.   I do system upgrades religiously for security reasons. 

Instead of disappearing how about helping us figure out what went wrong so it can be corrected?
« Last Edit: September 15, 2008, 06:57:12 pm by caitlyn » Logged

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stretchedthin
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« Reply #7 on: September 15, 2008, 09:26:35 pm »

I thought I would try to recreate the event that lead to edwards upgrade troubles myself.
I followed Caitlyn's instructions on a fresh install and my upgrade went as expected, without a hitch.

However, there where upgrades to the  xorg-server, to xf86-video-ati, xf86-video-nv and other components that could
have lead to the events edward described.

So my question for edward if you are still out there, is do you use ati or nvidea.  Or was there anything of note about
your xorg set-up that would help us identify the problem.

P.S. This shutterbug app rocks!!  (or am I just easily entertained.)
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newt
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« Reply #8 on: September 16, 2008, 08:23:49 am »

Like stretchedthin, I wanted to test the upgrade option as well.  I installed a fresh Light system with default choices, updated the repository database, and upgraded the packages.  Everything seems to have worked flawlessly, of course, I haven't tested every package that was updated but of the ones I have they are working great.  I noticed that I had more packaged to upgrade than stretchedthin (44 to be precise); maybe the repo's been updated with that many new packages since he ran the update or maybe he had not installed some packages during install that I did.  Who knows, either way both upgrades seem to have worked.

I cannot explain edwards troubles (partial desktop).  I would think that if ati or nvidia got knackered then he would not have got a desktop at all???
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caitlyn
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« Reply #9 on: September 16, 2008, 09:14:05 am »

I agree with Newtor.  If an X upgrade or a video driver upgrade had failed then he wouldn't have a GUI at all.  Somehow his LXDE configuration got clobbered.  The version of LXDE in the repository is the same as on the VL Light iso so there was no upgrade involved.

Edward said he used the default desktop for Light.  That's JWM, not LXDE, so he did make a different choice.  JWM should still be installed.  To correct his partial desktop all he would have had to have done is login to JWM instead of LXDE, copy the base configuration from his /root directory, change the permissions, and LXDE should have come back to life.

LXDE is alpha quality software that was offered as a third, promising option for the LIght desktop because people liked it during the alpha and beta testing period.  To jettison a distribution because a desktop configuration gets clobbered, well... Does anyone remember Xubuntu Feisty Fawn?  It came with a half-broken desktop on the iso! 

I've done system-wide upgrades on VL since 5.8 was released and I have yet to break my system doing it.  That's almost two years now.
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edward
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« Reply #10 on: September 16, 2008, 01:01:33 pm »

Didn't go anywhere.   Grin

When I turned the PC on today, the desktop came back perfectly...

I thought I was using LXDE, based on my reply in the OpenOffice.org thread I created about the lack of OpenOffice icons on the Office menu.  There is a blue Vector logo Menu icon at the lower left of the screen, when moused over, it turns red.

The video is actually a 3dfx Voodoo3 2000 PCI card with 16 Mb of video memory on the card.  I believe X would be using the "tdfx" driver by default, but I selected to use VESA during the installation, as when X used "tdfx" with other distros, it took up more than 1/2 of the total installed memory in the PC.





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caitlyn
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« Reply #11 on: September 16, 2008, 01:15:40 pm »

First, I'm glad you didn't go anywhere. 

Based on your description of the way the menu icon responds you are, in fact, using LXDE.  As you've noticed LXDE is still a very young desktop environment and it definitely has some bugs, though on my system they've been minor annoyances rather than showstoppers.  I still prefer Xfce but I believe LXDE is promising.

I still have no clue why your desktop would be hashed like that for one session.  I'm glad it is working now.  If you have any additional issues there are any number of us who will be happy to help you sort them out.
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VLocity Linux 7.0-rc1

HP Mini 110 netbook, 1.6GHz Intel Atom CPU, 2GB RAM, Intel 950 video
VL 7.0 Light
edward
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« Reply #12 on: September 16, 2008, 02:27:55 pm »

I also noticed in the Gslapt settings that kernel-related items are not enabled for updates.  I haven't run uname -r to see what version is being run.

But if unmarking those items will then enable the kernel to be updated, does the installer also automatically modify the LILO bootloader to use the new kernel on the next reboot?  Some distros I've tried before, did not do this with LILO, forcing a manual editing of (I think) lilo.conf.



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caitlyn
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« Reply #13 on: September 16, 2008, 02:37:29 pm »

First, it is a VERY BAD IDEA to ever upgrade a kernel.  You install a new kernel in parallel with the old one.  That way if you have a problem with the new kernel you can still boot into the old kernel.  I've seen folks do "upgrades" with other distros (not VL so far) and end up with a system that couldn't boot.

Slackware Apt (gslapt and slapt-get) isn't as mature as the Debian Apt.  It doesn't handle kernels correctly and would, in fact, do an upgrade.  That's why it's disabled.

There is an updated testing kernel (2.6.25.7) for VL 5.9 Light but none that's been blessed by the developers and moved into patches.  Please remember that VL Light didn't release until July.  The 2.6.22.19 kernel you have was patched for known vulnerabilities and I'm not aware of any serious security issues which would require an upgrade at this time.  Also, VL has a history of issuing patches rather than whole new kernels (i.e.: the novmsplice patch package for VL 5.9 Standard). 

To add a new kernel in Vector Linux at this time you download the packages and install them manually at the command line with installpkg.  In the case of the kernel I wouldn't want it to seem easy for a newcomer to Linux to muck about with it.
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VLocity Linux 7.0-rc1

HP Mini 110 netbook, 1.6GHz Intel Atom CPU, 2GB RAM, Intel 950 video
VL 7.0 Light
uelsk8s
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« Reply #14 on: September 16, 2008, 02:57:05 pm »

There is an updated testing kernel (2.6.25.7) for VL 5.9 Light but none that's been blessed by the developers and moved into patches. 

The kernels in http://vectorlinux.osuosl.org/veclinux-5.9/kernels/ have been "Blessed", But should not be moved into patches where gslapt/slapt-get could upgrade them.
If you download and install a new kernel and kernel-modules package all you need to do is run "vliloconf" from a terminal as root after to setup lilo to boot the new kernel. That will add the new kernel alongside the old so if there was any problem with it, the old kernel would still be bootable.

HTH,
Uelsk8s
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